New Skills and Classes
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Raptor
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 17, 2006 11:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Right, but you see my point. I think that right now dodge is like a lower level of agile manuvers. If you have more points in agile, then dodging shouldn't be an issue.

I just think dodge needs something more to justify it's existance.

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Marcus Brody
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 17, 2006 11:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

That's also a very good point. Perhaps I should have consolidated Evasive with Dodge, and left Impressive on its own. The problem in that case is that Impressive would be a far less useful skill than most of the others. What if I combined Breakaway and Impressive since they both require forethought? Maybe too powerful again...

I'll think about this...
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Dr. SexBot
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 17, 2006 12:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The problem with combining Dogtail and Strike or Breakaway and Dodge is that if you are in a duel, you come in with, lets say a 6 in Dogtail/Strike and roll with a +6 to gain dogtail AND a +6 to shoot at them once you are on. If they have spent the same amount of points as you they will have a 3 in Breakaway and a 3 in Dodge since they are 2 separate skills. It would be too easy to finish them since you would have double the bonus they do. The same problem occurs when you combine Breakaway and Dodge (I realize now) combining any of the pilot skills seems to pose a problem. The only thing I could see to combine Breakaway with would be maybe Agile. Then there would be 2 separate stats for dog fights on either side and in not many situations will you be using Agile and Breakaway (unless you are using Agile Maneuvers to break away and in that case it would make sense.) There are probably problems with combining those 2 as well, but I can't really see many right now.
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Marcus Brody
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 17, 2006 1:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The best solution I can think of right now would be Evasive+Dodge and Breakaway+Impressive, but that would more/less make anyone good in a dogfight also good in an airshow, which doesn't necessarily make sense. I have another idea to fix that, but I'm going to have to work on it tonight at work.
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Raptor
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 17, 2006 2:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm almost thinking it was better with more seperate skills right now.
The problem is that almost all of these skill bleed into each other in some way or another.

If you use a aerobatic manuver to lose someone who is tailing you, like the cobra manuver (very close to a hammerhead, just less flair and more control) for example, then what skill is it really? Combat pilots don't limit themselves to just tailing or dodging, or just to aerobatic manuvers. If you are good at the controls then most of that should be a matter of technique.
The same goes for other types of flying, some aerobatic flying is pure show, and some is derived or entirely based on practical combat manuvers.

What about a system that has basic stats for controling a plane, and uses skills for specific aspects, like aerobatic manuvers? I know, skill + stat for nearly every roll is more complex.... We could have a plane bonus and shoot to roll low too Wink

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Marcus Brody
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 17, 2006 3:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

How about this:

Dodge and Evasive Manuvers get combined. The new skill is called Evade.

The poll is being changed to reflect a new question.

I may add more classes, just so that people will have more options as to which skills they recieve a discount in.
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Raptor
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 17, 2006 4:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Like I said in the last post, they are similair in nature, but can also be different. It's a highly situational thing though....
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Bulkoth
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 17, 2006 4:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm a fan of simplification as long as the insp/exp curves change appopriately as im sure they will, having 5-6 crucial skills is a much better thing than having 7-9 skills with a couple that are useless 90% of the time but become crucial in those rare situations when you find your skills lacking.
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Marcus Brody
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 17, 2006 4:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Raptor wrote:
Like I said in the last post, they are similair in nature, but can also be different. It's a highly situational thing though....


I assume you're talking about Breakaway and Impressive. I'm going to try to get more manuvers into the game to help people specialize in the different aspects of the skills. That should establish the bonus as the basic proficiency, and the skills can give the extra boost of specialization.
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Raptor
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 17, 2006 4:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I am, and as much as i'm trying to keep character concepts out of system sugestions, I hate to make changes that move my character's specilizations into a general skill.
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Marcus Brody
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 17, 2006 5:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I sympathize with that, but I think that leaving Impressive Manuvers by itself makes it a bit of a weak skill. If you disagree it'll influence my decision, since you're the primary stunt pilot (Guin can wingwalk, but she's more of a combat pilot when actually seated in the cockpit).
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Silverhand
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 17, 2006 7:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

All of this makes a lot of sense. Me, I'm all for combining skills, less places to spend insp. Whatever you decide is good for me.

I agree that John's opinion matters more on the Manuevers part. He does moves that add flair to his flight. I just move as much as needed to get the job done. More no nonsense type flying, move in for the kill and get back home.

Though a word against combining things, If those are combined, even I would be able to pull off more impressive moves since I'd have to pump those skills to be effective in a dogfight.

I think learning individual moves would help with this, as Wolfram's would be more spectacular while mine are designed to get the job done. On that note, I have 2 special maneuvers now, one that gives a bonus to MD and one that gives a bonus to DTB. These will have to be reworked in light of the skill review as well.

Yeah, I can wingwalk. But thats because I'm an Acrobat. Not an Aerobat.

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Marcus Brody
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 17, 2006 7:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

If I can find some way to make Impressive better, I'll leave them seperate. Oh wait...I just thought of one! Cool
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Silverhand
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 19, 2006 6:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I must say that the new skill sets seem pretty powerful to me. Before last night, I would not have been able to hit those targets. Well I might of, I rolled well last night, nothing below 15. But the big swing was 4 point difference between FS and my new S skill, plus the gun gave a S instead of MS bonus. I didnt get to stay long enough to try anything else out. Sad thing is, I didnt do squat till 1030, they didnt even fricking need me there.
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Marcus Brody
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 19, 2006 6:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

That sucks. We actually more/less quit playing after you left.
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